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Keith_H
Joined: 18 Oct 2009
Posts: 17
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 Posted: Mon May 10, 2010 10:37 pm Post subject: determining which ships were in port at a given date |
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Hi All,
I am trying to research the ships which returned to the UK with Home-Popham in December 1812.
Whilst I am aware that the Venerable, Fox & Latona arrived at Portsmouth, there were some ships which arrived in Plymouth, the only one of which I am aware is the Diadem.
Could someone please give some pointers on what sources could be consulted, so as to determine which other ships had returned from Santander (San Andero).
Thanks, Keith |
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PMarione
Site Admin
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
Posts: 883
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| Posted: Wed May 12, 2010 10:01 pm Post subject: |
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That's the question at 50 eur.
TNA could be of some help. I don't know any ADM series that can help except for the log books.
If you have the name of the ships, you can check if the relevant log book still exist for the relevant period.
Another source are the newspapers, they normally announced the arrivals I suppose to reinsure the familes with people on board.
You can also check the Naval Chronicle (not the abridged version recently published). Its available on the web (www.archive.org).
@+ P |
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Keith_H
Joined: 18 Oct 2009
Posts: 17
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| Posted: Wed May 12, 2010 11:14 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for the response. I was advised this month by a forum contributor that some Naval Chronicle editions were available, but volume 29 does not appear.
http://historicnavalfiction.com/index.php/general-hnf-info/naval-facts/the-naval-chronicle
There is no mention in the Diadem log of accompanying ships that I could find. I'm wondering if orders to/from Home-Popham (or George K Elphinstone) would mention those ships that returned to Plymouth from Santander.
The newspapers could be worth following up.
Thanks Patrick |
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Keith_H
Joined: 18 Oct 2009
Posts: 17
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| Posted: Wed May 19, 2010 10:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | If you have the name of the ships, you can check if the relevant log book still exist for the relevant period. |
Therein lies the problem. One possibility is that the Caird Library was bequeathed the papers of Lord Keith (George K Elphinstone)
http://www.nmm.ac.uk/collections/archive/catalogue/record.cfm?ID=KEI
'[Lord] Keith's private papers form only a very small part of the collection but as a flag-officer he kept the most routine of letters: for each major command, particularly that of the Mediterranean, there are numerous accounts and returns which provide a detailed picture of victualling and the other general problems of an overseas fleet. There are also complete lists of ships' dispositions for all his major commands.'
This could be of use in determining the ships that sailed.
In addition, he was in frequent contact with Home-Popham
A guide to these papers exists in the form of a paper binder, so you are obliged to go to Caird Library to consult the binder and work out"what is out there".
The following looked interesting to me
KEI/38/2 Jul-Dec 1812
KEI/38/3 Jan-Apr 1813
KEI/40/2
KEI/37/2 Correspondence with Home-Popham
| Quote: | | Another source are the newspapers, they normally announced the arrivals I suppose to reinsure the familes with people on board. |
Are there any newspapers that you can suggest?
This website was a good pointer
http://www.plymouthdata.info/Newspapers.htm
This sounds like the most likely publication to contain what I'm after:
Plymouth and Dock telegraph |
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ionia
Joined: 08 Sep 2007
Posts: 46
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| Posted: Wed May 19, 2010 11:14 pm Post subject: |
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Keith's orders to Popham dated HANIBAL, in Hamoaze, 11th December, 1812 state:
"You are therefore to return to Portsmouth with the VENERABLE, Marines and troop-ships".
The inference is that the other large ships had gone home earlier since only frigates and sloops were to be left on the coast of Spain.
Is there nothing helpful in "A Damned Cunning Fellow"?
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Ionia |
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Keith_H
Joined: 18 Oct 2009
Posts: 17
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| Posted: Thu May 20, 2010 11:14 pm Post subject: |
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Yes, therein lies the problem; the names of the troopships. I do not know which troopships other than Diadem brought back the Marines to Plymouth. Diadem had only half of the 2nd Battalion on board, and a fraction of the 1st Battalion had somehow arrived in Plymouth, while the rest of the 1st had arrived off Portsmouth (in Fox, Latona & Venerable)
There was nothing in neither "A Damned Cunning Fellow", nor in "Admiral Lord Keith and the naval war against Napoleon", disappointingly enough. |
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